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Bob Barr for President?

25 May 2008 06:13 pm

[Tim Lee]

Hi, my name's Tim Lee and I'm one of those think tank people Megan warned you about. I'd like to thank her for letting me share her soapbox for the week. You can learn more about me at the link above.

Today the Libertarian Party nominated Bob Barr as its presidential standard-bearer for 2008. I've got a love-hate relationship with the Libertarian Party. As a small-L libertarian, I typically find the major party options to be wretched, and this year's options are especially bad. So it will be nice to have someone on the ticket who I can be reasonably sure will mostly take positions I generally agree with.

Unfortunately, the LP has a knack for picking candidates who are not just uninspiring, but often acutely embarrassing. The 2004 candidate, Michael Badnarik, was a low point. As I wrote at the time, despite billing himself as a "constitutional scholar," he was completely clueless about American government. His speeches and interviews were chock full of assertions that could have been corrected with 30 seconds of fact-checking, and his overall message was that of a paranoid, government-hating crank.

And because presidential elections are virtually the only time a lot of people pay attention to politics, a lot of people wind up associating libertarianism, the ideology, with whomever the LP chooses to nominate every four years. And since the LP's candidates are often clueless, politically tone-deaf, or otherwise unappealing, small-L libertarians get stuck trying to explain that, no, most libertarians aren't for legalizing child pornography, and no, not all of us have turned our skin blue by drinking a "homemade antibiotic laced with silver."

Bob Barr isn't in the same category. He understands the basics of public policy and appears able to get through an interview without embarrassing himself. However, he seems to have a whole different category of baggage: questions about whether he's actually a libertarian. During his tenure in Congress, Barr showed few libertarian tendencies, voting for the Defense of Marriage Act, opposing medical marijuana, and signing on to the Patriot Act. I saw him speak here in Missouri last year and he gave a pretty convincing Road to Damascus speech, but libertarians are justifiably suspicious.

Personally, I'm doubly wary of supporting the guy after the Ron Paul fiasco. Like Will Wilkinson, I gave money to Paul in 2007, before I learned of his continuing association with the bigots who sent out racist newsletters under Paul's name. In retrospect, Paul's anti-immigration rhetoric and his tendency toward conspiracy theories ("Wall Street bankers" are a staple villain in his stump speeches) should have been red flags that temperamentally, Paul was more a conservative nationalist than a libertarian even if he happened to have reached libertarian conclusions on a lot of policy issues.

The issue section of Barr's campaign website makes me nervous that we're in for a repeat of that fiasco. It's incredibly thin—a dozen or so bullet points in total—and one of the four categories is "secure our borders," which suggests Barr may harbor the same kind of borderline xenophobia that has infected both the Paul campaign and much of the modern conservative movement. That's not the impression I want voters to get of libertarianism.

Ultimately, I wish the LP would just go away. The structure of American elections dooms third parties to perpetual failure and obscurity, and that, in turn, creates a vicious cycle where the most talented activists and potential candidates go elsewhere, causing the party to be even more out of touch and politically tone-deaf in the next election. But given that the party is going to nominate somebody, Barr was probably the best choice. He's a reasonably credible candidate, he's got decent media skills, and so far, at least, I haven't seen him take any positions that I strongly disagree with (since his road-to-damascus conversion in 2006, anyway). But I don't plan to support his candidacy because while he may be the least-bad option on this November's ballot, he certainly isn't the kind of person I want associated with libertarianism. And every vote he gets will mean more visibility for the embarrassing candidate the party is likely to nominate in 2012.

Comments (51)

I'm sure you felt as though you needed to post something since you're our subsitute blogger but that was a waste of a read. I feel as though I just read in a complete circle.

"Ultimately, I wish the LP would just go away" and "I don't plan to support his candidacy because while he may be the least-bad option on this November's ballot, he certainly isn't the kind of person I want associated with libertarianism. And every vote he gets will mean more visibility for the embarrassing candidate the party is likely to nominate in 2012"

Tim are you arguing that libertarian ideas should remain intelectual ideal and never be actively promoted before the public? You seem to have forgoten that one reason for existance of third parties is to give a platform for ideas and if these ideas garner enough support these ideas do move into the mainstream and perhaps take some of their most capable advicates with them.

I too am not comfortable with Bob Barr leading the libertarian party but I will continue to argue for more third parties to broaden the political debate.

If given time I do become comfortable with Barr then he will get my vote if he fails that then perhaps I will find another candidate. One thing I won't do is vote for the lesser of two evils. Since, I refuse to vote for evil!

Sorry, I will not vote for Barr only Ron Paul. Paul, is the best option.

Although I liked a great many of the nominees, it would have been insane to throw away the name recognition of someone like Bob Barr. He has definitely committed past boo-boos, but has been coming around to the libertarian position for several years now. I don't mind that he once held non-libertarian views on the drug war, etc -- especially since I once shared them. I got educated and changed my mind -- and allow others the same privilege.

I want Americans to change their minds on liberty. I want former conservatives and former liberals to change their minds. They will have voted for the wrong things in the past. Nevertheless, I welcome them.

Same Here! -Ron Paul only, even if a write in (unless someone else appears) Bob Barr does not have a very clean record, especially compared to Paul.

The whole newsletter thing was just stupid, heck I could have put out Newsletters under the man's name, anyone could have.

Same Here! -Ron Paul only, even if a write in (unless someone else appears) Bob Barr does not have a very clean record, especially compared to Paul.

The whole newsletter thing was just stupid, heck I could have put out Newsletters under the man's name, anyone could have.

Hate to break it to you Tim, but you've got a better chance of the GOP or Democratic Party going away than the LP. The LP's just getting started.

@Steve - The argument Tim is making is that there are brilliant, more-than-credible people capable of aruging for libertarian ideas. But they are located in think tanks, academia, journalism and the business world. Where they are scarce is in third-party politics, which attracts only those willing to raise money, fight for ballot access and lose and lose and lose badly in nearly every competitive partisan election.

So, unfortunately, the folks left fighting for this small prize (the LP presidential nomination) are from the best and brightest the libertarian world has to offer. Give that, Tim's saying, he prefers they just cease to exist. Which, I'd say, is as much a pipe dream as the idea that the LP will actually win the presidency.

"Ron Paul only" is an awfully narrow voting strategy. Do you vote for him for every office he's not a candidate for, or just for president?

Why not just vote for Barry Goldwater? He's just as irrelevant to the race as RP, and with an even longer history. Just because he's been dead for 10 years is no reason to stop voting for him.

Tim,

While I am not exactly overjoyed by all the candidates the LP has nominated and I hold LP candidates to a higher standard than the drones generally anointed by the old parties, unlike the media I also refuse to give a pass to the character and judgment defects of old party candidates merely because one of them is almost certain to win.

As the last seven years of the reputedly-ex drunk who is our current President bring into high relief, the stipulated bad judgments, the bfinancial scandals and moral defects of his predecessor did not disqualify him from, in retrospect, doing a credible job during his two terms. If Bill Clinton is good enough to have been a better than average President, and Jimmy Carter with his heart-lust bilge and downright ignorant views (for someone who claims to be a nuclear expert) on nuclear waste reprocessing is looked upon wistfully as at least being honest, I can tolerate a 2% ideological deviation in an LP Presidential candidate.

I personally think Bob Barr wants revenge upon libertarians (big and little-L) who targeted him for removal from Congress because of his abominable policy positions and they niftily accomplished the mission. Maybe Barr has changed his ways, maybe he hasn't.

Dr. Mary Ruwart is a much kinder, gentler, credible choice whose approach is human and appealing. What's more she has no quirky baggage that I'm aware of.

Requiring perfection and nothing for which they could have been ridiculed would have disqualified Messrs. Washington and Jefferson as well as honest souls such as Cleveland. Libertarians must be saints but savvy politicos of the traditional stripe may be fine so long as their indiscretions didn't result in actual felony convictions?

We need an LP or those who have earned its blessing (e.g., Rep. Paul, despite real head-scratchers like his benighted view on evolution and his troubling anti-choice stand, as well as the fake pseudo-issues you cited) to put the feet of the cynical power-freaks of both old parties to the fire.

If it were not for his LP run in 1988, do you think RP would have been on the dais for (most of) the GOP debates, winning new fans across the political spectrum for non-interventionisf foreign policy, sound money and the plaintext of the Constitution? Do you really?

"Ultimately, I wish the LP would just go away." - Tim Lee

It would appear that people who are sincerely committed to the idea that there is no such thing as collective identity have a very hard time getting themselves organized.

Tim Lee, no understanding of monetary policy, but loves talking like he does.

Better Barr than McNutts any day...Considering RP won't have the Republicrat nomination I will vote for Barr!

This is just more neo-con b.s. from the neocon Atlantic rag. This is McCain's biggest nightmare. Barr will steal votes all over the country from McCain. What is this writer all worried about? You fools control Obama, the so called man of change! lol. Here's a news flash for the writer, the Libertarian Party is not going to go away. It will only grow thanks to Barr's nomination and the GOP demise.

Joe opines: Barr will steal votes all over the country from McCain.

Good one, considering that there's nothing that anyone* would be interested in to differentiate Barr from McCain. I strongly suspect that his only interest is in something else, such as selling books.

* "Anyone" is defined as "more than 10,000 people".

Bob Barr is a plant and so is this author.

No "libertarian", even as a small "l", would ever call somebody a "government-hating crank" like that was a bad thing.

You and Bob Barr can both go to hell. And tell the neo-cons you work for they cannot buy us off. We'll keep coming for them no matter how many distractions they throw up for public consumption. Two can play at that game, and we're coming for them.

The message of freedom is stronger than ever, and this feeble attempt to torpedo the burgeoning Ron Paul movement by placing a neo-con hack inside the Libertarian Party will not work. We'll just vote for Chuck Baldwin of the Constitution Party, or we'll write in "Ron Paul" in November. Either way, a message will be sent, and in 2012, you're all in deep shit.

Tim, even if Ron Paul really was paranoid and evil as you seem to think, he still is head and shoulders above the rest from a libertarian perspective. The dirt thats been dug up on Ron Paul pales in comparison to that on Clinton, Obama, or McCain. Position-wise, he is a very good candidate. As far as immigration is concerned, I don't want to see the United States become just another Latin American country anymore than a typical Mexican would want to see Americans flood Mexico and dilute or replace authentic Mexican culture. Ron Paul's sense of nationalism on the immigration issue has a much broader appeal than the LP's internationalist "the USA is everybody's country" position in support of open immigration. I will vote for Bob Barr, even though he is a substantially poorer representative of what I believe than Ron Paul.

I'd recommend that you read Bob Barr's book The Meaning of Is (2004) before judging him politically. This is a must read. Don't be misled by the title. It's a bombshell criticism of both parties, describing the abuses of power by President Clinton, which served as precedents for President Bush, and how Republicans fought Barr when Barr fought Clinton. Barr writes, "As America burned, the Republican Party was fiddling away." (p. 114)

Particularly interesting is Barr's description of Newt Gingrich's behavior when Gingrich abruptly discontinued the fight against the Clinton budget in 1995, telling them that "he was going to keep a list of every member who did not vote to cave on the Clinton spending package and that the list would later be used to punish us." (p. 223)

In one battle Barr did succeed, by rallying libertarians. He describes how an FBI "wish list", which included many of the things Democrats complain so vehemently about with Bush, came to light and how the Clinton administration "drafted a massive anti-terror package and sent it to Congress," some provisions of which Barr successfully defeated in 1996 "by banding together with libertarian-leaning conservatives and civil libertarians in the Democrat ranks." (p. 87)

Barr writes of his cooperation with the LP in 1998, and remarks, "The Libertarian Party actually seemed to grasp the significance of Clinton's assaults on individual freedom." (p. 102)

Tim, along a different vein, do you know Barr's position on intellectual monopoly grants?

Is this written by the same Timmy on South Park?

Talk about scraping the bottom of the think tank.

Hey Meagan, with friends like this you should think about getting out more.

TIM-MAY!!!

Tim, I hear you on the Ron Paul stuff. My husband and I donated a lot to his campaign, only to kick ourselves later for not doing due diligence. (Sorry, Ron Paul supporters - ties to racism are not an acceptable trade off for me... no matter how libertarian the candidate is.) I'm glad to hear someone else regretted donating as well.

Bob Barr has way too much sketchy stuff in his past. Banning Wicca in the military? Defense of Marriage Act? This guy seems like a social conservative who's hijacking the Libertarian party. I'm just going to sit this one out, as usual.

Tim,
You seem a little indecisive--which is better than being decisively inflexible. The question you might want to ask yourself is this: do you believe that an omnipowerful government of fallible and corruptible people, who are disposed to "deciding" everything for us (from social security to warfare, taxes and landowner/property rights) is superior to a largely self-governing populace of Americans who are restrained by a set of laws that is applied equally or at least non-arbitrarily? If you answer this question in the direction of favoring an omnipowerful government, then your choice is simple: just vote for whomever the party selects. If you answer in the direction of "free will" and "free choice," then you will consider all the alternatives. Then, you will make a rational decision and your conscience will be clear.

If the concern is "reality" versus "idealism," then you will argue with yourself about the idealism of those following Constitutional principles versus those who practice more "realistic" applications of governance--such as those who want to build an Empire in the Middle East, tax the public beyond its means, support endless warfare, etc. Really, there isn't much of an argument here. So, you're back to voting for what makes you feel good: choose that option and forget the mathematics of elections, campaign slogans, and so forth. You'll sleep better at night.

Kari,

Come on. Give RP some credit. Do you really believe the "racist" rumors junk?
That stuff was debunked over 10 years ago...it's just a recycled rumor used to tick people like YOU and ME off, discredit Dr. Paul, and distract people from the truth.

Haven't you ever been lied about so well that the evidence against you made even your mother wonder?
I know I have. Lies and rumors like these stick so deeply in hearts and minds that they are nearly impossible to erase. Think about it.

Come on. Give RP some credit. Do you really believe the "racist" rumors junk?

If you sell something, you stand behind it. He profited from newsletters with his name on them, so he is responsible. Whether he wrote it or not is irrelevant.

It's black and white. There are no rumors to disbelieve. I've read the newsletters He endorsed them by having his name on them. End of story.

The President of Austin NAACP claims to have known Ron Paul for 20 years and that he is not a racist. Check it out.

Pretty dumb kari. If I thought Ron Paul was racist, I wouldn't vote for him. In fact, he points out the problem with racists and how the only way to deal with it is to treat people as individuals. Something I rarely hear those who like to cry racism EVER consider. Rather, those are the same people who are the problem because they group everything into "black and white".

Ron Paul is without a doubt the least racist candidate I've seen in my lifetime. He truly does see only individuals.

Ha ha! That's right, trot out the old propaganda smearing Ron Paul as a racist (too bad you can't come up with ANYthing new...) while hyping the biggest NeoCon hypocrite former CIA-member Mr. War On Drugs himself, Bob Barr.

Typical pro-Libertarian/pro-Bob Barr anti-Ron Paul crap. It's all so transparent. You are a NeoCon applauding the infiltration of the Libertarian party by Bob Barr. Ron Paul supporters are too smart to fall for that old trick and will steer way clear of the Libertarian Party from now on.

Bob Barr is not fit to shine Ron Paul's shoes and I hope the author goes back to the NeoCon sewer he climbed out of.

P.S. Brad Linzy, you go, my brother! You took the words right out of my mouth. We know what's going on, don't we?

Won't Get Fooled Again

Hmm...just treat people like individuals and racism will go away? That only works if racism has not been institutionalized to such an extent that it is difficult for people of the "wrong" ethnicity to buy a house. This is why there are open housing laws. And the only people who don't think that stuff like that still happens in America today are people who have never ventured outside their precious gated communities.

Like most libertarian ideas, this one is simple, elegant, requires a minimum of government intervention, and doesn't solve the problem at hand at all.

Tim is redcoat nazi trash. If it weren't for google search engine I wouldn't have found this sh*thole of a blog anyway.

I'm tired of the self-identifying "small-l libertarians" bitching about who the LP nominates when THEY refuse to take part in the nominating process. If you want a decent candidate, show up at a convention (there were only 650 here in '08) and get seated as a delegate. Sadly, libertarians -- small or big "L" -- prefer whining on the Internet over actually playing big boy politics.

Barr was the best option here in terms of getting the party's name out and helping our local candidates actually win elections. I liked Gravel, and I think he's just as sincere as Barr and Root in their recent conversions, but Gravel is seriously lacking in the organization department. And I just couldn't let Mary Ruwart ruin this party with her crazy, half-baked bullshit again like she did in '83 when she endorsed Bergland (although, the thin-skinned and grudge-holding Cato people share some of the blame for the two decade cooling period).

You guys went bananas for paleocon Ron Paul -- just like the '88 convention. At least Barr is a moderate (and this is coming from a radical who couldn't endorse the Radical Caucus' crap candidate) who doesn't spend all his time bitching about the Fed and the North American Union. Every time I tell someone I'm a libertarian now, I get, "Oh, like Ron Paul?" NO! NOT LIKE RON PAUL! RUSSELL MEANS FREEDOM!

Steve,

Kevin is right, I think there are lots of ways to promote libertarianism other than running for office. Working for a think tank, for example, or as a journalist.

There's also a lot of progress to be made in single-issue advocacy. I'm a donor to the Electronic Frontier Foundation, the Marijuana Policy Project, and the Institute for Justice, all organizations that use a combination of litigation and lobbying to advance pro-freedom ideas. Here in Missouri, I've been involved with an effort to put eminent domain reform on the Missouri ballot. These are all ways to actively promote freedom without running candidates for office.

Political campaigns are an absolutely terrible forum for discussion of ideas. They're conducted in 30-second soundbytes, which just isn't enough time to explain libertarian concepts (or any other ideas for that matter) in a compelling way. I think the libertarian movement would be better off focusing on changing the climate of ideas and doing single-issue activism. Let the R's and D's waste their time running candidates.

Of course, Kevin's right that the LP isn't going away any time soon. But that doesn't mean I can't wish it did.

Casey, thanks for the book recommendation. I'll have to check that out. And no, I don't know Barr's position on copyright or patent issues.

Kari, thanks for the comment. I agree with you that the excuses of Paul and his supporters are unpersuasive. You don't put your name on something unless you're willing to stand behind its contents.

And guys, just in case this wasn't clear from my post, I'm not claiming that either McCain or Obama would make better presidents. But Barr isn't going to be president, so it's sort of irrelevant if he'd make a good one. The question is whether Barr's candidacy will help or hurt the spread of libertarian ideas, and on that I think the jury's still out.

No wonder this dude, the 'author', and MM are friends..It's all so transparent.

"That's right, trot out the old propaganda smearing Ron Paul as a racist (too bad you can't come up with ANYthing new...) while hyping the biggest NeoCon hypocrite former CIA-member Mr. War On Drugs himself, Bob Barr.

Typical pro-Libertarian/pro-Bob Barr anti-Ron Paul crap. It's all so transparent. You are a NeoCon applauding the infiltration of the Libertarian party by Bob Barr. Ron Paul supporters are too smart to fall for that old trick and will steer way clear of the Libertarian Party from now on.

Bob Barr is not fit to shine Ron Paul's shoes and I hope the author goes back to the NeoCon sewer he climbed out of."

Posted by blakmira | May 26, 2008 2:18 AM

X2

I'm not sure what's more amazing, that there are peep, like 'Tim Lee', that will put their name on something like this, or there are org's, like the theATLantic, that will pay him for doing so..

Silly me, I thought Prostitution was illegal in most jurisdictions..

Over the last eight years, Bush and his GOP Congress have demonstrated that they are worse than the Democrats on a whole lot of issues, including the ones that they were supposed to be good on like spending and fiscal responsibility. Even worse, the average GOP voter has become slavishly devoted to Bush and confuses loyalty to the country with loyalty to him personally. The trend is very troubling.

The LP has always seemed more like a sanctuary for the faithful, rather than a political party that actually wants to win elections and affect change, which is why I haven’t been involved with them. However, their nomination of Barr and Root seems to indicate that they’ve changed.

I view this as a very positive development because we need an outside force that will be a catalyst for change in the GOP, just as the Socialists were a catalyst for the transformation of the Democratic Party.

Barr is a neocon in disguise. Does he really think Ron Paul supporters are going to throw their support his way? Pa-lease. Either write in Ron Paul or vote for chuck Baldwin (constitution party).

How can people with this much lack of education even get to write this stuff. Paul is Racist huh??? Produce any evidance that Paul wrote or said any of that stuff , and is or was it true??? No matter who said it a fact is a fact, and the fact is the riots did stop in LA when it came time to pick up the Welfare cks. If it makes those people who were rioting look alittle, "shallow" then they need to look in the mirrior not point the finger at truth speakers, no matter who says it. I back this statement cause it is true and we have video to prove it. Some day truely educated people will be judge not by how much money they have but by how much truth they speak. lets look at it this way. To be insane is to go out everyday and do the same thing over & over & over expecting a differant resalt or outcome. Now lets look at the majority of Americans, they go out and vote for there parties candidate, " who's chosen by the to elite of your party... Not you!!!" and you go vote for them hoping for change but no change ever happens. Name 1 law the Dems. or the republicans have passed in the last 15 yrs. that benifits you or your family???
Nothing!!! Then why are you still voting for them... Are you flippin insane!!! We need to call them Republicrats. We put the Dems. in control of our houses to get us out of the war with about an 87% agreement of the people of this country. Whats the one thing Dems haven't done??? If they don't care about 87% of Americans then what makes you think they give a crap about you, your family, or your freedoms??? This isn't insanity this is boarder line stupidity!!! Why are you still voting for these sickos/Republicrats???
Ron is the only candidate left running that can offer and produce real change and help us, "The People!!!"
lets let the Dems. and the Reps. Know we have had it with their lies, greed, and power kicks!!!
Lets start putting Libertarians in office and put a total end to the Republicrats.
Lets put Ron Paul in the White House for the People, freedoms, and truth!!!!!!! What do we have to lose??? The other parties haven't accomplished sqwat so let see what some new Ideas from our Countries founders. You know those who made this graet country for over 200 yrs. the last hundred yrs. have been nothing but a waste do to our current political leaders, also known as the elite riches puppets. And to the editor I leave my Phone # 814-384-2658. Feel free to call me to talk about your fascist and slandering ideals!!! Wake up America and stop listening to un or under educated people!!!

Thanks again for your time, Scott.

Bob Barr is one creepy dude. His off stage antics were particularly troubling as filmed by CSPAN. After Barr said he went to high school in Tehran, he qualified his remark to a man who inquired about his schooling - Barr then went on to say it was his senior year 65-66, and that Iran was warring with India at the time so further insinuated that he really didn't get to finish his schooling there. Guys and gals, we have NO MORE ROOM for liars, cheat, "what I meant to say", BS artists in government at all. YES..he is a neocon hack trying to pull the rug from out of the challenge the party would wage against McCain. Watch CSPAN and witness for yourself as he scurries around like a cockroach asking, "Where is the California people". Start thinking about moving to Canada gang.

In this zany election year, no one has any idea of what might happen in November. Hillary and Obama have split the delegates, each pulling 1/2 each. Maybe the Democrats will look for some who can appeal to more than 50%? On the other hand, the Republicans are in the losing seat and they need someone to pull them out of their doldrums. The Republicans are about to anoint someone who does not hold much promise to do that. Maybe the Republican delegates will wise up rather than waste their money traveling to ST. Paul for no good reason? And there is a lot of support brewing for Ron Paul's ideas. At some point, freedom ideas might become fashionable. They might hit the public like a brick. WE don't know. All it takes is a few nights of Network news pounding to change the public. The best course of action to is continue to promote freedom ideas and see what your options are in November.

And if anyone has any doubt about the wackiness of the self-proclaimed libertarians, look at the Ron Paul brigade....

(Honestly, guys--you're just embarrassing.)

Although I do hope you manage to pull something off at the Republican convention--I hope you manage to make it as much of a fiasco in Republican history as 1968 was for the Democratic Party.

Go Ron Paul!

I live in Atlanta and have been aware of Bob Barr for twenty or more years, since the time he was a Federal Prosecutor. For many of those years I was active in the Libertarian Party. Barr was somewhat a nemisis of ours. I remember once about twelve years ago hearing him speak at a FIJA (Fully Informed Jury Association) meeting. He was supportive of our position on the rights of juries. However, we got into a long discussion of legalizing drugs and our chairman finally stopped it, saying we were beginning to sound like a NORML meeting. I often disagreed with Barr, but I always had a respect for his intellectual integrity that was far greater than I had for other Republican or Democratic office holders. I always thought of him as being a man of high character, even though we disagreed. I am happy to see that he has moved closer to my opinion on many issues and am happy that he has received the nomination for President of the Libertarian Party. He is not a pure libertarian by any stretch of the imagination. However, he is moving in that direction and it may be that he will appeal to many others who are also moving in that direction, both from the rights and the left.
One of the reasons I stopped participating in the Libertarian Party was that I did not perceive the leadership as having any real desire to attain political power. They seemed to want to remain a debate club. Nominating Bob Barr for President indicates to me that this might be changing.

best wishes, Howard Davis

"which suggests Barr may harbor the same kind of borderline xenophobia that has infected both the Paul campaign and much of the modern conservative movement."

Which illustrates why the LP will never be more than a fringe party, since its advocates try to define what the large majority of the US electorate thinks is pregmatic nationalism into "borderline xenophobia".

Spend some time on the left coast. Try the K-mart in Cudahy (LA) where the signs are all in Spanish, the announcements are all in Spanish, and they've been that way for the last 35 years.
We *assimilated* all of the other waves of immigration, but it isn't happening in southern CA, because of the relentless torrent of humanity coming over the border, pushing further and further. We can't afford it, in social, political or financial terms.

"which suggests Barr may harbor the same kind of borderline xenophobia that has infected both the Paul campaign and much of the modern conservative movement."

Which illustrates why the LP will never be more than a fringe party, since its advocates try to define what the large majority of the US electorate thinks is pregmatic nationalism into "borderline xenophobia".

Spend some time on the left coast. Try the K-mart in Cudahy (LA) where the signs are all in Spanish, the announcements are all in Spanish, and they've been that way for the last 35 years.
We *assimilated* all of the other waves of immigration, but it isn't happening in southern CA, because of the relentless torrent of humanity coming over the border, pushing further and further. We can't afford it, in social, political or financial terms.

Bob Barr is a legitamate candidate,like non other the Libertarians have chosen.He is second to none in this presidential election,and far more honest and aware of this countries needs than any other candidate.In fact he is overwhelmingly the most credible 3rd party candidate "EVER" !Only an idiot would vote for McCain or Obama liar over Barr.

"The issue section of Barr's campaign website makes me nervous that we're in for a repeat of that fiasco. It's incredibly thin—a dozen or so bullet points in total—and one of the four categories is "secure our borders," which suggests Barr may harbor the same kind of borderline xenophobia that has infected both the Paul campaign and much of the modern conservative movement."

So, let me get this straight: merely thinking that illegal immigration is a major problem and that our borders need to be secured is evidence of "borderline xenophobia"?

And you're a "libertarian" in what sense? Ah well, I guess anybody can call themselves whatever they want.

Bob Barr is a bigoted, homophobic, anti-drug conservative Republican that hijacked the LP. He is about as anti-Libertarian as you can get. He didn't even balance the ticket with a Left Wing candidate and got his fascist thugs to bully the party during the convention. No real libertarian - Big L or little l would ever vote for the man. He will, however, be able to pander for disenchanted Republican votes and he will eventually turn the LP into what he really wants: a homeless shelter for conservative Republican refugees.

A Declaration of Withdrawal from the Republican Party

My reasons for leaving the Party that I’ve felt at home in since I became politically aware are numerous. I will start with quoting countless conservatives who feel as I do - I didn’t so much leave the Republican Party, it was the Party that left me. The elected Republican officials failed to implement a conservative agenda, despite having the Presidency and both houses of congress. No Child Left Behind, Prescription Drug Entitlements; they even tried to force Amnesty for illegal aliens upon us. They have given us a government that would make even LBJ blush. Our businesses and land have more regulatory red tape to deal with than ever.

Where is the Republican Party that stood for limited government, personal responsibility, a strong national defense, and against being the world’s policeman? As recently as the 90’s Republicans railed against a foreign policy of “making the world safe for democracy”, (which is historically the Democrats foreign policy, ala Woodrow Wilson) when Bill Clinton was President and he took us to war in Bosnia and Kosovo, without U.N. approval I might add. Which reminds me, the United Nations is something the GOP used to believe we needed to get out of, not an institution to be defended when a rogue nation violates U.N. resolutions.

I am also reminded of former Senator Robert Taft, who was known in his day as Mr. Republican, when he said “I do not believe any policy which has behind it the threat of military force is justified as part of the basic foreign policy of the United States except to defend the liberty of our own people” and my favorite President - Thomas Jefferson, who said “peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations, and entangling alliances with none.”

From its inception, the Republican Party advocated a humble foreign policy in line with our founding fathers recommendations, now, with John McCain as the leader and voice of the GOP, we are told to get behind his idea for a “League of Democracies” which sounds terrifyingly similar to Wilson and his Progressive Democrats “League of Nations” almost 100 years ago.

We are also being told by McCain that we will have to Cap and Trade our liberty and our pursuit of happiness in the fight against global warming, essentially that if we don’t give government more money and power, utopia will never be reached.

Some have told me that I should support him because he will appoint conservative judges, but I ask these questions - 1. Who’s definition of conservative are we talking about? And 2. Why would I trust the man on this issue when he is one of the “Gang of 14” who was blocking President Bush’s conservative lower federal court and Circuit Courts of Appeal judicial nominees? I would also remind you of his historical propensity to appease those even more liberal than himself. His version of “reaching across the aisle” looks more like a group hug when he crafts legislation like the McCain / Kennedy and McCain / Feingold bills. McCain / Feingold happens to be the reason McCain should not get the NRA’s endorsement, the NRA spent years fighting this trampling of our 1st amendment rights. McCain has not been the solid 2nd amendment supporter he would like you to believe he is - he had a barely passing “C” grade from the NRA in his last senate run in 04’ , and in 2000 worked with Americans for Gun Safety, an anti-gun group with a deceiving name.

The differences between McCain and Obama are minimal, when you consider that both believe big government can save you from yourself, and that we can save other nations from themselves as well. Given McCain’s track record of conciliatory dealings with Democrats, I fear what this man would do with a Democratic House and Senate. I will not play along with the game of lesser of two evils, as I believe that is part of what has plunged this nation into the mess we find ourselves today.

Once upon a time the Republican Party stood against special interests, corruption and abuse of power. Today their candidates campaign is “ of the lobbyist, by the lobbyist, for the lobbyist.” A man who admits Washington’s corruption has tainted him. Google Keating 5 and read all about it.

The Republican Party today would be unrecognizable to my favorite Republicans of yesterday, such as Barry Goldwater, who said “ A government that is big enough to give you everything you want is big enough to take it all away.” President Eisenhower, who warned us of the Military Industrial Complex, and one whose party membership is a surprise to many today but shouldn’t be, Martin Luther King Jr. “ Violence is a poor chisel for carving out peaceful tomorrows.” The party is just as unrecognizable to myself and others of my generation.

I had to draw a line in the sand, and the Republican Party wasted no time in crossing it, when they and the President pushed for “economic stimulus checks.” The only problem is this, the money isn’t money that we have, its money we are borrowing, and our excessive borrowing becomes a tax on future generations, as we wont be paying it off any time soon. Want to try to sell this as economically conservative? Excessive borrowing and spending has the added affect of devaluing our currency, so it acts as a hidden tax on us today. As I heard one of the presidential candidates say in regards to these stimulus checks, “ Whose economy are we stimulating here? Ours or Chinas? We are borrowing more money from China so everyone can go buy more stuff made in China.” I get it, others in the GOP get it, so why doesn’t the party leadership?

I can’t take anymore disrespect for conservative values, and unless the Republican Party wakes up and gets it’s head on straight real soon, I will be taking my vote, my time, energy, money, and passion from the GOP and taking it to the Libertarian Party to send a message to the Republican leadership that I will not be taken for granted. I believe that it is solid conservatism that wins the day and elections - limited government, individual responsibility, and a strong national DEFENSE (secure the borders!), not conciliation and surrender to Democrats to the point that our differences become blurry.

The Libertarian Party seems to be a perfect temporary home, the GOP has its work cut out if its sincere about winning me back, even President Reagan said “Libertarianism is the very heart and soul of conservatism.” I will be doing everything I can to sway like minded conservatives to join me in this exodus and vote for Bob Barr for President and Wayne Root for Vice President on the Libertarian ticket. Both of them were recently Republicans, and are among those countless conservatives I‘ve heard myself say “ It wasn’t that I left the Republican Party, it was the Party that left me.”

Please visit bobbarr2008.com and give conservatism a voice in the Presidential debates and beyond.


Thanks and God Bless, from Zak Carter

I have no idea how I came to be here, but here's my 2 cents worth:

First, we're all democratic. The Democrats have stolen that word to mean them and only them.

Second, I wish the America First Party had more teeth, or whatever. Now they stand for everything I believe in. If you've not heard of them, check them out.

And sadly, third, every vote for Ron Paul or this Barr guy is a vote for Obama, who just may be the anti-Christ.

Bob Barr gets my vote. To me there are only three choices, Obama, McCain, and Barr. Ron Paul is not on the ballot in my state of FL. For the people that say I'm wasting my vote I say Barr wins by a landslide. The momentum for Barr will be fast and furious. For those voting for Obama or McCain I say the odds of your vote changing the election are nil, you minds well vote for the best they have to offer.

Bob Barr gets my vote. To me there are only three choices, Obama, McCain, and Barr. Ron Paul is not on the ballot in my state of FL. For the people that say I'm wasting my vote I say Barr wins by a landslide. The momentum for Barr will be fast and furious. For those voting for Obama or McCain I say the odds of your vote changing the election are nil, you minds well vote for the best they have to offer.

Libertarians use "NeoCon" like geeks use pocket protectors. Yeah, I know what it means, but the lady going to the supermarket does not and, more importantly, cares not. Why should you care about her, then? You should care because she votes...and her ballot counts as much as those of all of you fanatical fringe Libertarians who spend your days "discussing" the finer points of classical liberalism and lighting candles for Ayn Rand. Libertarians, you need to stop picking on each other and cease your debates about "what the founding fathers' REALLY meant" when they wrote the 123rd line of the U.S. Constitution. Here's some campaign advice: If you want to convert the Devil, you have to start by playing in Hell. Go convert the uninformed, media-following, sound-byte-hearing average voter while she is on her way to the market. You'll have to stop attending your 17-letter committees and talk straight to her (in HER real, contemporary world--aka your Hell), about how libertarian ideas work to her benefit and the well being of her family. She will end up electing the first Libertarian Senator or even President before she even registers Libertarian. You hardcore, intellectual Libertarians need to first get off your computers and out of the libraries and then get outside into the real battleground of the politically uneducated. That's how elections are won. P.S. Barr won't take votes away from McCain, McCain will take votes away from Barr.

Due to the uncalled for meddeling (of the current 90 day and less administration)in the Georgia/Russia affair in Europe, I have just dumped my current (40+ years) party affiliation. MY VOTE NOW GOES TO BOB BARR, a strong America and the Libertarian party. I'm tired of the incompetence and destruction of America by the Demo's and Rep's.
I'm only one of several thousands that will also VOTE FOR BARR and Sanity.